comparing alpha 1 and alpha 2

nice test.

would be quite effective at testing distros with builtin multimedia support etc too I suppose.

now all you need to do is set up a web site with all the other distros for everyone to compare

www.(thefastest)distrotoinstallbootstartbrowserdownloadandplaymusicthenshutdownwatch.com (ive checked the website doesn't exist)

don't forget if its a 1999 pc, so its probably got a 1999 hard drive running at 1999 speeds, also the op could be including boot to grub time aswell.

Oh.  you think maybe its that 5.25 inch floppy drive, slowing things down a tad?
hmm.
yeah.  hadn't thought about that!  Guess I should try on a somewhat newer computer.

Thanks luc.
1.  counterintuitive that one should rely upon either KDM or GDM, if one is working with "openbox".
2.  looks to me as though you are issuing commands.
Where did you do that?  Oh,
I guess you left off a couple of steps:  eh?  like, the user must FIRST invoke the bloody gd "terminal", and pretend that we are working, NOT with modern 5.25 floppy disks, but rather, with the BIG floppies used in the 1970's when that garbage with the keyboard was so popular.
I am not a big devotee of TYPING anything.
3.  I am even LESS impressed by typing commands out of the air.  How did you KNOW which commands to type?  The user is staring at the desktop, post install, and clicking furiously with his/her mouse, trying to find the equivalent capability, which is right there in front of his/her nose, using XFCE.  How is one supposed to KNOW, that with openbox, contrarily, there will be no such capability????????  Is that supposed to be intuitive:  Use openbox = move back forty years in time?

Thank you benj1.  Yes, it is a 1.1 GHz cpu, and the point here is very simple:
#! is WELL-SUITED to "old" computers, notwithstanding the fact that it is not included among the distros at distrowatch.com which are associated with old computer capability--an error, in my opinion.

Further, if one asks this question:  how is Linux (any version) potentially useful, an answer is this:  Old computers can be converted to internet radio stations, to play any music one wishes, for free.  As I mentioned earlier, despite the age, and the long boot times, due to the ancient nature of the hardware, the system, once it begins, is indistinguishable, in terms of listening to the music, to a contemporary device which costs a thousand dollars or more....

To answer your question, yes, the time measured for boot is from power on, so, the limitation of the GRUB installer becomes a factor here.  For example, when installing slackware, using Patrick Volkerding's excellent LILO bootloader, the user is able to indicate which OS to include in the menu, and how long to wait, prior to booting.  Since I employ xosl, I don't like to wait any time upon choosing Linux, but, the installer for ALL Debian distros denies the user this opportunity during the installation.  I am sure that someone who knows the innards of linux could fix this problem, but, so far, no one has.  So, yes, time is wasted because of cycling through GRUB, unless the user sits there, watching the paint dry, waiting for Godot, and attending to the GRUB prompt.  I am far too lazy to waste any effort on that activity, hence, it takes longer to boot #! than comparable slackware based distros.

CAI ENG

Sorry I did not understand all of that but does the auto login work now or do you need more information?

The feature of Ubuntu, which I find VERY attractive, is the ability to select automatic login, bypassing the password crap during the installation, rather than fumbling around afterwards trying to figure out which icons to click on, to accomplish the same goal.  No other distro offers this capability, in my experience.

Actually, I guess my metaphor flew over folks heads, I was attempting to juxtapose the primitive, obsolete 5.25 inch floppy drive, with the far more obsolete method of user input (comparable to the truly ancient, 8 inch floppies of the 70's) i.e. the keyboard, also very much in vogue in the 1970's.  Whereas the hardware world has made one or two tiny improvements since the 1970's, the software world is mired in the bog, determined to continue working as we had been compelled to do, forty years ago....

Ah.  I see.
Linux is only for experts.  Ok.  Sorry to have wasted your time.  Somehow, I imagined that the forum was intended to solicit a variety of viewpoints, including those from people lacking a doctorate in linuxology.....

In my non-humble opinion, a poorly designed user interface defends its anti-intuitive character by attacking either the intelligence of, or the knowledge of, those who experience a modicum of difficulty understanding how to perform the necessary post-installation configuration.  To my way of thinking, there ought not be ANY distinction between OpenBox and XFCE, from the perspective of the user seeking to modify the default login status of the OS.  This problem should not, logically, have existed in the first place, if the installer had properly inquired from the user if he/she preferred to invoke passwords and logins, or not.

No, it would be impossible for me to disagree more thoroughly with you.

You are absolutely wrong.  The "lightweight" character of the OS has NOTHING to do with how carefully, or thoughtlessly the installer has been constructed.  In this case, #! simply adopts, without modification, the default Debian installer.  The defect here is due to the primitive character of the Debian installer, and certainly has nothing whatever to do with any supposed "lightweight" feature of #!.

How does one define "lightweight"?  Hmm.  What, size of the distro?  Oh?  Sure about that?  I don't think so.  How about the SPEED with which one executes a task? 

I have found, in comparing various "lightweight", and "heavy" distros, that the single easiest way to ascertain the "weight" of an operating system, is to measure the time it takes to power off the computer.

distro......time to power off (seconds) (same computer as at start of this thread)

Mandriva.............30
#! alpha 2............9
Puppy 4.3.2........10
PCLOS Kde..........29
Zenwalk 6.4........30
Kongoni '10.........55
Debian '10...........12
win XP................10
Win 98................5

Thank you very much luc, I appreciate your kindness, both in responding, and subsequently in asking for feedback on your suggestion.

Excellent forum etiquette, I am very impressed.

Sorry for the opacity of my writing, which makes it so difficult to understand.  In part this is due to an undesirable verbosity, and in part to simple ignorance of Linux.

Autologin does work, at last, again, as it did formerly, under alpha 1, because I am now running XFCE, with a cute little mouse skipping about at the boot up.

I abandoned OpenBox, Luc, as user hostile.  I am not inclined to go running about engaging with the terminal as if I were transported back in time to the 1960's when we were obliged to type commands to do even the simplest chore.....

Thanks ben, nope, don't know anything about it.  Certainly have no idea about "repos", though I did receive a telephone call yesterday from a guy threatening to repossess my car, for nonpayment.....
(Sorry, that was meant to be a joke, because my car is so old, no one would ever seek to repossess it!!)

Ah, you must be referring to "repository".  Nope, no idea where it is, or how to access it.  Is that the infamous "Synaptic" business?

I love these utterly confusing terms.  Synapse, the Greek word, means to transfer an electrical signal from a neuron, via calcium released at the pre-synaptic axon terminal, to the post-synaptic dendrite which then depolarizes, and the resultant depolarization, if it reaches threshold, will elicit generation of an action potential to be conveyed on to the next neuron in the "chain".  The idea is that there is NO PHYSICAL connection between the two cells.  The synapse represents a method of communication between two cells which almost, but not quite, TOUCH one another.  It is thus, rather discordant to encounter such terminology in the world of operating systems, for our connections are all based upon intimate physical contact, the antithesis of a synapse.

Where I want to be looking Ben, is not in a repository, somewhere, it is in the installer program.  I seek to advise the responsible author(s) of #!, that even though this is the best available Linux distro, it is imperfect, and could be greatly improved by two modest changes in the installer:

a.  enable autologin, regardless of the desktop manager, if the user so desires;

b.  switch to Patrick's Lilo;

CAI ENG

Thank you anonymous, two excellent suggestions.  Much appreciated.

CAI ENG