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#1 2013-07-12 19:22:44

farinet
#! Junkie
Registered: 2012-11-03
Posts: 296

iceweasel 23 ...

On another machine (running siduction and razor-qt) i'm already with iceweasel 23 while on crunchbang i seem to be blocked to v20. Why? I've the same identical sources.list (following this instructions pointing to unstable and beta. But it does not install 23. Any idea?

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#2 2013-07-12 19:25:21

DebianJoe
#! Code Whisperer
From: The Bleeding Edge
Registered: 2013-03-13
Posts: 1,207
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#3 2013-07-12 19:39:06

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,238

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Thanks to both of you, I looked again at the How-To posted by CBizgreat! and I have a better understanding of why I currently only have Iceweasel 20.0.


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#4 2013-07-15 09:02:23

farinet
#! Junkie
Registered: 2012-11-03
Posts: 296

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

DebianJoe wrote:

My mozilla.debian already points to experimental? I followed the instructions but to no effect, iceweasel in the repositories still is 20.01 . . .

Last edited by farinet (2013-07-15 09:07:35)

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#5 2013-07-15 16:01:20

VastOne
#! Ranger
From: V-Ger
Registered: 2011-04-26
Posts: 10,165
Website

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Run

apt-cache policy iceweasel

and post the results ... this will show what versions are available to your via your sources


VSIDO | Words That Build Or Destroy

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#6 2013-07-16 00:36:45

farinet
#! Junkie
Registered: 2012-11-03
Posts: 296

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

iceweasel:
  Installiert:           20.0-1
  Installationskandidat: 20.0-1
  Versionstabelle:
     23.0~b4-1 0
        200 http://mozilla.debian.net/ experimental/iceweasel-beta amd64 Packages
     22.0-1 0
        200 http://http.debian.net/debian/ experimental/main amd64 Packages
 *** 20.0-1 0
       1001 http://packages.crunchbang.org/waldorf/ waldorf/main amd64 Packages
        100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
     17.0.7esr-1 0
        500 http://http.debian.net/debian/ unstable/main amd64 Packages
     10.0.12esr-1+nmu1 0
        500 http://http.debian.net/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages

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#7 2013-07-16 00:49:06

annoyingbeggar
#! Junkie
From: Florida
Registered: 2013-05-30
Posts: 430

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Edit /etc/apt/preferences and change Waldorf from 1001 to 990. Then apt-get -t experimental install iceweasel


“I don't believe in charity. I believe in solidarity. Charity is so vertical. It goes from the top to the bottom. Solidarity is horizontal. It respects the other person. I have a lot to learn from other people.” - Eduardo Hughes Galeano

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#8 2013-07-16 01:00:57

VastOne
#! Ranger
From: V-Ger
Registered: 2011-04-26
Posts: 10,165
Website

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

sudo apt-get -t experimental install iceweasel

Would be sufficient... as explained in detail here when you select unstable from the drop down


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#9 2013-07-16 01:26:21

annoyingbeggar
#! Junkie
From: Florida
Registered: 2013-05-30
Posts: 430

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Waldorf being pinned over 1000 means the upgrade won't stick.

-t only moves an item to 990...


“I don't believe in charity. I believe in solidarity. Charity is so vertical. It goes from the top to the bottom. Solidarity is horizontal. It respects the other person. I have a lot to learn from other people.” - Eduardo Hughes Galeano

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#10 2013-07-16 01:36:21

VastOne
#! Ranger
From: V-Ger
Registered: 2011-04-26
Posts: 10,165
Website

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

From man apt-get

-t, --target-release, --default-release
           This option controls the default input to the policy engine; it
           creates a default pin at priority 990 using the specified release
           string. This overrides the general settings in
           /etc/apt/preferences. Specifically pinned packages are not affected
           by the value of this option. In short, this option lets you have
           simple control over which distribution packages will be retrieved
           from.

This overrides the general settings in /etc/apt/preferences is the key detail in that setting unless I am completely misunderstanding it

I use the exact instructions from and have never altered /etc/apt/preferences.  Anytime there is an update to Iceweasel from that source, I get it.  I am sitting at version 24.0a2 (2013-07-12) now

Edit -

This line makes your point

Specifically pinned packages are not affected by the value of this option


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#11 2013-07-16 01:51:53

annoyingbeggar
#! Junkie
From: Florida
Registered: 2013-05-30
Posts: 430

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

http://wiki.debian.org/AptPreferences

See the section about preferences greater than 1000


“I don't believe in charity. I believe in solidarity. Charity is so vertical. It goes from the top to the bottom. Solidarity is horizontal. It respects the other person. I have a lot to learn from other people.” - Eduardo Hughes Galeano

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#12 2013-07-16 06:29:09

farinet
#! Junkie
Registered: 2012-11-03
Posts: 296

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Thanks to you all. It's a bit confusing; me myself  i never touched the pinning safe yesterday, when i tried to get iceweasel installed (and since it did not work, i changed the pinning back to how i found it before).

I do not really understand, how i should set the pinning to not have downgraded iceweasel after the next dist-upgrade ... (?)

Thanks in advance!

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#13 2013-07-16 14:29:12

annoyingbeggar
#! Junkie
From: Florida
Registered: 2013-05-30
Posts: 430

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Drop the testing repo unless you need it for a specific package. As it is you are pulling from unstable anyway (newest version wins.) I also wouldn't recommend keeping the #! repo on unstable. Instead of removing it all together, we'll pin it low so you can force install any of the script packages you might need.

This will leave you with an /etc/apt/preferences that should look like this.

Package: *
Pin: release a=unstable
Pin-Priority: 700

Package: *
Pin: release a=experimental
Pin-Priority: 200

Package: *
Pin: release a=waldorf
Pin-Priority: 100

If, for some reason, you want to keep the Waldorf specific builds then you just need to change the waldorf pin to this

Package: *
Pin: release a=waldorf
Pin-Priority: 990

If you want to understand why I chose those numbers read below from the apt_preferences man page

man apt_preferences wrote:

Priorities (P) assigned in the APT preferences file must be positive or negative integers. They are interpreted as follows (roughly speaking):

P > 1000
    causes a version to be installed even if this constitutes a downgrade of the package.
990 < P <=1000
    causes a version to be installed even if it does not come from the target release, unless the installed version is more recent.
500 < P <=990
    causes a version to be installed unless there is a version available belonging to the target release or the installed version is more recent.
100 < P <=500
    causes a version to be installed unless there is a version available belonging to some other distribution or the installed version is more recent.
0 < P <=100
    causes a version to be installed only if there is no installed version of the package.
P < 0
    prevents the version from being installed.


“I don't believe in charity. I believe in solidarity. Charity is so vertical. It goes from the top to the bottom. Solidarity is horizontal. It respects the other person. I have a lot to learn from other people.” - Eduardo Hughes Galeano

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#14 2013-07-16 15:23:28

farinet
#! Junkie
Registered: 2012-11-03
Posts: 296

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Thanks a lot for your patience. Things became clearer to me big_smile big_smile

Just to be sure:

unstable covers, practically, testing (more toward cutting edge, so far)?
waldorf, even though low pinned, would still install its specific issues (like the nicely concatened cb-... scripts for openbox, graphics and so on), correct?

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#15 2013-07-16 15:51:01

annoyingbeggar
#! Junkie
From: Florida
Registered: 2013-05-30
Posts: 430

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

With waldorf pinned at 100 you will lose the waldorf specific builds for newer versions. So, for example, instead of the waldorf version of Thunar you'll be running (the far superior) version 1.6 that is in unstable. You will keep the pipe menus, compositor, and all of the other applications that only exist in the waldorf repo because there is nowhere else to pull them from. You will also still be able to install the waldorf packages if you need to in the future. (ia32-libs seems to remove the pipemenu scripts for some reason so you will still be able to reinstall them to restore functionality).

With it pinned at 990 nothing will change on your system except that you will be able to force the use of newer applications if you want to (as is the case here with iceweasel). Waldorf will retain highest priority but will no longer downgrade packages because it is pinned below 1000.

A third solution would be to simply remove the preferences file. This would result in the default Debian behavior of "newest version wins." You would pull the newest iceweasel from moz.deb, the newest other programs from unstable, and the waldorf only packages from waldorf. This works well (it's how I setup my vanilla Debian systems) but pinning gives you a bit more control over the process.


“I don't believe in charity. I believe in solidarity. Charity is so vertical. It goes from the top to the bottom. Solidarity is horizontal. It respects the other person. I have a lot to learn from other people.” - Eduardo Hughes Galeano

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#16 2013-07-17 21:35:03

Barnabyh
#! Die Hard
From: Church of the Subgenius
Registered: 2012-11-07
Posts: 825
Website

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

How does Backports fit in here? On my stable box they show up in Synaptic but the relevant packages do not upgrade when running apt-get and it's just a pain to select them all one by one in the GUI.


From ArchBang to SlackBang | Project SlackBang

Say no to bugs. - It's not a bug, it's a worm.

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#17 2013-07-17 21:52:58

pidsley
Window Mangler
Registered: 2012-05-23
Posts: 1,752

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Barnabyh wrote:

How does Backports fit in here? On my stable box they show up in Synaptic but the relevant packages do not upgrade when running apt-get and it's just a pain to select them all one by one in the GUI.

For more information about backports, check out these topics:
http://wiki.debian.org/Backports
http://backports.debian.org/Instructions/

The short answer is that backports are designed to upgrade single packages at the user's specific request. They are not designed for general upgrades. If that's what you want you would be much happier with Testing or sid.

Debian wrote:

Backports cannot be tested as extensively as Debian stable, and backports are provided on an as-is basis, with risk of incompatibilities with other components in Debian stable. Use with care!

It is therefore recommended to only select single backported packages that fit your needs, and not use all available backports.

Last edited by pidsley (2013-07-17 21:56:06)

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#18 2013-07-18 00:21:41

Barnabyh
#! Die Hard
From: Church of the Subgenius
Registered: 2012-11-07
Posts: 825
Website

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

Ah, thanks for that insight and the quick reply, pidsley.


From ArchBang to SlackBang | Project SlackBang

Say no to bugs. - It's not a bug, it's a worm.

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#19 2013-07-18 07:10:58

farinet
#! Junkie
Registered: 2012-11-03
Posts: 296

Re: iceweasel 23 ...

annoyingbeggar wrote:

With waldorf pinned at 100 you will lose the waldorf specific builds for newer versions. So, for example, instead of the waldorf version of Thunar you'll be running (the far superior) version 1.6 that is in unstable. You will keep the pipe menus, compositor, and all of the other applications that only exist in the waldorf repo because there is nowhere else to pull them from. You will also still be able to install the waldorf packages if you need to in the future. (ia32-libs seems to remove the pipemenu scripts for some reason so you will still be able to reinstall them to restore functionality).

With it pinned at 990 nothing will change on your system except that you will be able to force the use of newer applications if you want to (as is the case here with iceweasel). Waldorf will retain highest priority but will no longer downgrade packages because it is pinned below 1000.

A third solution would be to simply remove the preferences file. This would result in the default Debian behavior of "newest version wins." You would pull the newest iceweasel from moz.deb, the newest other programs from unstable, and the waldorf only packages from waldorf. This works well (it's how I setup my vanilla Debian systems) but pinning gives you a bit more control over the process.

Thanks a lot for all that insight!!! big_smile big_smile In real life i'd owe you more than a bottle of good wine wink

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