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#1 2014-01-09 19:29:10

damo
#! gimpbanger
From: N51.5 W002.8 (mostly)
Registered: 2011-11-24
Posts: 5,127

References for new users

I don't think there is already a place for this on the forums (anyway I didn't find it), but how about a prominent sticky with a list of helpful links?
User Snap just posted some good stuff here, and it got me thinking that since we all have our own bookmarked helpful urls, it would be good to have an easily-found selection. Anyway, I find it useful to see what others find helpful, and I can add them to my own list.


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#2 2014-01-13 22:40:17

anonymous
The Mystery Member
From: Arch Linux Forums
Registered: 2008-11-29
Posts: 9,419

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#3 2014-01-13 22:59:06

retf
#! CrunchBanger
From: On top of spaghetti
Registered: 2013-12-25
Posts: 200

Re: References for new users

I'm pretty new to Crunchbang, and rather newer to the forums here.  I've tried to answer lots of questions - which helps me learn as well... I was unaware of a Crunchbang Wiki -- and it's great that there is one...

Just few points though...
I haven't noticed an easy to spot link to the wiki on the front page...
And the all black background is very irritating one my eyes --- lots of ghosting after reading a few lines...

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#4 2014-01-13 23:01:37

porkpiehat
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2012-10-02
Posts: 972

Re: References for new users

retf wrote:

I was unaware of a Crunchbang Wiki -- and it's great that there is one...

The wiki is no longer being maintained or updated, so it's best that it's hard to find.


You can't make anything idiot proof because idiots are so ingenious.

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#5 2014-01-13 23:12:48

damo
#! gimpbanger
From: N51.5 W002.8 (mostly)
Registered: 2011-11-24
Posts: 5,127

Re: References for new users

Yes, I know of those links. Both date back a long time, and are quite ad hoc imo. I was thinking more along the lines of:

Openbox configuration - themes
                                           keybinds
                                           menus
                                           GTK themes
Tint2 configuration
Conky configuration
Useful/common terminal commands
HowTo - Sound
                Network
                Monitors
Apt/Synaptic/Aptitude
Dual booting
etc
etc

The "wiki" would do the job if it was maintained and easily accessible - we need some volunteers to look after it properly


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#6 2014-01-13 23:23:38

porkpiehat
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2012-10-02
Posts: 972

Re: References for new users

damo wrote:

The "wiki" would do the job if it was maintained and easily accessible - we need some volunteers to look after it properly

The wiki is locked. Corenominal decided not to maintain it.


You can't make anything idiot proof because idiots are so ingenious.

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#7 2014-01-13 23:26:07

anonymous
The Mystery Member
From: Arch Linux Forums
Registered: 2008-11-29
Posts: 9,419

Re: References for new users

If you have specific suggestions for cleaning up the quick reference thread, feel free to PM a mod so he/she can edit the thread. However realize that maintaining a wiki or forum thread can be a lot of work particularly to do so voluntarily and without pay.

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#8 2014-01-13 23:28:30

Snap
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2013-10-22
Posts: 551

Re: References for new users

+1

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#9 2014-01-13 23:48:46

damo
#! gimpbanger
From: N51.5 W002.8 (mostly)
Registered: 2011-11-24
Posts: 5,127

Re: References for new users

anonymous wrote:

...However realize that maintaining a wiki or forum thread can be a lot of work particularly to do so voluntarily and without pay.

Having had to maintain a website I know what you mean.

Have you had a look at the disabled Help menu items in /etc/skel/ ? (Screenshot in Ideas for Janice) That would be a good start imo

Last edited by damo (2014-01-13 23:49:17)


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#10 2014-01-13 23:53:18

Snap
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2013-10-22
Posts: 551

Re: References for new users

Agreed. That's a great extra for newcomers along with cb-welcome. Experienced users would easily remove them if they don't want them.

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#11 2014-01-13 23:55:32

retf
#! CrunchBanger
From: On top of spaghetti
Registered: 2013-12-25
Posts: 200

Re: References for new users

I volunteer for wiki duty...

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#12 2014-01-14 00:17:49

porkpiehat
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2012-10-02
Posts: 972

Re: References for new users

retf wrote:

I volunteer for wiki duty...

Good idea. Maybe you can talk to the people who are starting an unofficial wiki: http://crunchbang.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=27590&p=1

Or the people who were trying to maintain the original wiki: http://crunchbang.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=19207

Or maybe just read what corenominal thinks: http://crunchbang.org/forums/viewtopic. … 66#p268366


You can't make anything idiot proof because idiots are so ingenious.

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#13 2014-01-14 01:25:14

retf
#! CrunchBanger
From: On top of spaghetti
Registered: 2013-12-25
Posts: 200

Re: References for new users

Well...
After looking through some of the required reading - I think I'm out of my depth to go through and figure out what's what on the Wiki...

And - if I ever get to the end of the wiki-to-do-thread - maybe I'll add a few thoughts of my own --- but I'd have to say that so far I agree and opine:

1. The current wiki is very confusing.
2. The white text on black background is extremely difficult for me to read - I had to change my browser's color management to read anything.
3. Many of the forum posts requesting help are repetitive and redundant again - most could be solved with a few web searches and a little reading.  However, this also means that new users are looking here for answers rather than elsewhere.
4. A short wiki with a few common tasks and problems that don't change much from distribution to distribution would be great.

This last item is what I had in mind - but I don't know - maybe there are too many cooks in the kitchen --- which is great that everyone wants to help, but can be confusing... so maybe I'll exit stage left and go back to attempting to answer as many forum questions as I think I'm adept at answering...

Sorry if I've offended anyone or anyone's work - don't/didn't mean too...

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#14 2014-01-14 01:39:37

anonymous
The Mystery Member
From: Arch Linux Forums
Registered: 2008-11-29
Posts: 9,419

Re: References for new users

retf wrote:

3. Many of the forum posts requesting help are repetitive and redundant again - most could be solved with a few web searches and a little reading.

Unfortunately I don't think this is something we can necessarily fix. "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink" comes to mind.

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#15 2014-01-14 08:18:04

Snap
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2013-10-22
Posts: 551

Re: References for new users

4. A short wiki with a few common tasks and problems that don't change much from distribution to distribution would be great.

Arch Wiki covers that pretty well. One of my usual references.

Anyway, for #! specific stuff and basics (OpenBox, Tint2, arandr, SLiM, launchers, installing drivers, etc... ), a kind of Welcome thread or basic guide would be nice. Something that newcomers might be pointed at like reading the forum rules.

The AV Linux manual comes to mind. Though it now changed to Xfce, both the 6.0.1 (still on LXDE and OB) and 6.0.2 user guides served me well to start in Crunchbang. Something like this for starters will be of invaluable help. Specially for those like me coming from DE distros, The windows manager approach is a whole mew world needing some eye opening and guidance.

http://www.bandshed.net/AVLinux.html

IMHO, Gmaq did a great job putting these basic user manuals together.

Last edited by Snap (2014-01-14 08:26:27)

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#16 2014-01-19 21:14:52

KrunchTime
#! Die Hard
From: not where I belong
Registered: 2012-03-02
Posts: 3,060

Re: References for new users

damo wrote:

Yes, I know of those links. Both date back a long time, and are quite ad hoc imo. I was thinking more along the lines of:

Openbox configuration - themes
                                           keybinds
                                           menus
                                           GTK themes
Tint2 configuration
Conky configuration
Useful/common terminal commands
HowTo - Sound
                Network
                Monitors
Apt/Synaptic/Aptitude
Dual booting
etc
etc

The "wiki" would do the job if it was maintained and easily accessible - we need some volunteers to look after it properly

Tips, Tricks & Scripts forum?


Linux User #586672
I like colorized diffs, but let's face it, those particular color choices will make most people decide to pick out their eyes with a fondue fork. -- Linus Torvalds

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#17 2014-01-19 21:34:27

damo
#! gimpbanger
From: N51.5 W002.8 (mostly)
Registered: 2011-11-24
Posts: 5,127

Re: References for new users

@KrunchTime

I reckon I have been poor at explaining what I mean sad All that info is available, but is quite haphazard imo.
I was trying to suggest something more general that would act as starting place for further info - pointers to Openbox wiki, Conky at sourceforge, linux commands references, an apt-get tutorial etc. Tips and FAQs referencing Statler aren't what new users need imo.

The (disabled and out of date) openbox Help menu items are a good start for a references layout
cb-help-menu.jpg


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#18 2014-01-19 22:32:19

anonymous
The Mystery Member
From: Arch Linux Forums
Registered: 2008-11-29
Posts: 9,419

Re: References for new users

Barring apt-get, it seems like all those things you mentioned are general Linux questions. Considering this is the #! forum, wouldn't most users be looking for information pertaining to #! (i.e. Statler/Waldorf)?

We already have a lot of information to help newbies. It's just all (dis)organized in the Tips, Scripts & Tricks forum.

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#19 2014-01-19 23:17:41

porkpiehat
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2012-10-02
Posts: 972

Re: References for new users

Round and round we go. People do ask "general Linux" questions here; questions that can be answered at other sites. #!, whatever specialness we may attribute to it, is Debian, and Debian is Linux, and often questions people ask here are answered by "general Linux" sources. Damo is trying to make these answers easier for people to find, and I think this is a good idea; including links to "general Linux" sources, like the Openbox wiki, conky docs at sourceforge, and others, can only help new users.

Unfortunately, this topic may have outlived its usefulness, as the arguments pro and con don't appear to be going anywhere, and people don't seem to understand what damo is suggesting.

Last edited by porkpiehat (2014-01-19 23:19:17)


You can't make anything idiot proof because idiots are so ingenious.

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#20 2014-01-19 23:32:00

anonymous
The Mystery Member
From: Arch Linux Forums
Registered: 2008-11-29
Posts: 9,419

Re: References for new users

porkpiehat wrote:

I think this is a good idea; including links to "general Linux" sources, like the Openbox wiki, conky docs at sourceforge, and others, can only help new users.

FWIW the now defunct #! wiki actually had such links on some pages. Examples:

http://crunchbanglinux.org/wiki/configuring_rc.xml
http://crunchbanglinux.org/wiki/conky

Also in the WM/DE Talk section, there are two threads for Openbox and Xfce resources. Depending on how extensive you want this reference to be, it may or may not be trivial to create similar threads (for other subject matters) and then just ask the mods to sticky them.

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#21 2014-01-19 23:36:37

porkpiehat
#! Die Hard
Registered: 2012-10-02
Posts: 972

Re: References for new users

The "now defunct #! wiki" doesn't help new users; the best suggestion is for links in the Openbox menu. Why is there so much resistance to a new possibility? But this topic is now as pointless as "ideas for Janice" so I'm done. Thanks for all the fish.

Last edited by porkpiehat (2014-01-19 23:40:06)


You can't make anything idiot proof because idiots are so ingenious.

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#22 2014-01-20 10:55:44

wuxmedia
wookiee madclaw
From: Back in Blighty
Registered: 2012-03-09
Posts: 1,478
Website

Re: References for new users

porkpiehat wrote:

But this topic is now as pointless as "ideas for Janice" so I'm done. Thanks for all the fish.

lol  lol  lol   roll

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